right on. Japanese tamos , both regular and folding cut down on the bulk/weight of a tradtional fishing net.
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That is horrible. I have not seen that…but have seen the “cooler” guy who takes well beyond the limit and just fills the cooler. In those cases I have said something and sort of “scared” them off. Fortunately I do not see that very often. Honestly until @Gressak mentioned C&R vs C&Kill, I had not thought of the potential increased damage a good C&R angler could do over a very casual catch and kill angler. something to keep in mind.
Holy molly! did you get a photo??
No photo…I was in shock and just witnessed it. It was both amazing and horrifying. So much for that released fish. It sort of stuck with me how handicapped a released fish is.
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Today I was able to release all fish with out leaving the water. Barbless hooks, did not show the guys I was fishing with. I took no pictures either. All fish where lip hooked and swam off with vigor.
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Thank you for the education I’ve not taken the advice lightly, and strive everyday to be more humane. Today no fish left the water, all released quickly while still very active. While I’ve used barbless for some time as others point out it’s only a part. I would rather loose fish after fish than land them.
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Tyson,
There is nothing humane about being a fisherman.
It is a double edge sword. Imposing those concepts on someone.
I always enjoyed your posts and pics and would note that even with my outings i risk some mortality for the sake of documenting my outings.
I think its fair for us to do things how we like. I hope you will continue to do things how you please.
The rules above…i believe are true…but just the same I do break them or bend them and am fine with the consequences.
I mostly posted it because it is a universal topic of interest.
No matter the fishery.
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Some of those parr marks rub off on your finger tips? Hahaha…
Yeah…haha. paint had not dried and even though the trout fin had a sign…wet paint…do not touch…i went ahead and touched it. Could not resist being defiant.
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Somewhat pertaining to handling methods and survival rate:
Perhaps they’re a bit heartier, but 100% of the sunfish species that I’ve: caught, landed, handled with wet hands, de-hooked, and then put in a half-filled Homer 5 gallon bucket have survived for months until being released.
Fish were in the 2-4" long range and consisted of small bluegill, redear sunfish, green sunfish and one small largemouth bass.
Probably something like an hour passed from capture until placement in a 29 gallon aquarium. Fish were kept until overall biomass became too large. The bass had to leave first. It was a bit unnerving watching that thing swim around with a goldfish tail hanging out of its mouth for a couple hours, while its gut expanded to fit the other two it had eaten just prior. It managed to stick around for about a month. The other fish were happily swimming around the aquarium for 3-9 months.
So, my current thoughts are that careful handling is fine. In fact, if you watch some tropical fish breeder videos, you’ll see them handling fish of 4-5 years of age, and have done so many, many times over a fish’s life.
Still, if you don’t have to handle the fish to de-hook, so much the better. The less time out of water, the better. But keeping the fish in the water, setting up your photo composition, then quickly getting a photo before release? I doubt this has a big effect on mortality rates.
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most panfish are incredibly resilient as are most warm water fish.
This link does a nice job of comparing fish by type and interesting that they also classify as spiny rayed finned fish. trout/salmon being without spiny rayed fins.
https://www.fs.usda.gov/detail/r6/plants-animals/fish/?cid=fsbdev2_027112
trout are not as robust as panfish or warmwater species. They are far more sensitive and delicate creatures. There environment has to be specific in order for them to survive, where panfish and other warm water species seem to thrive just about anywhere.
The mouth of a trout is a very delicate device. Next time you examine a panfish compare the structure of its head and mouth to a trout’s. In general the membranes are much much thicker.
It would be an interesting thing to try. Try keeping a trout in a freshwater tank. I bet it would be a challenge. You may need the water to be refrigerated.
This article alludes to the challenges…1000 gallon tank for 2-3 fish…where we know we can keep a sunny in a bucket of water almost indefinitely…
I won’t disagree with you that Trout aren’t as hardy as panfish, but I’d take that particular article with a heaping tablespoon of salt.
For instance, it recommends 300-500 gallons per fish in an aquarium, and in a pond, they recommend 9 feet of depth. Pretty sure that’s waaaay beyond what hatcheries are doing water volume wise. Know for a fact that the depth is much less in hatcheries.
Also, there’s the “Trout in the Classroom” programs around the USA. They use much, much smaller tanks than 200-1000 gallons. They go from eggs to fingerlings in aquariums that look to be about 55 gallons.
Oh, I just remembered there’s the trout tank at the Monterey Bay Aquarium. Nowhere near 3-500 gallons per fish, and these fish aren’t fingerlings, they’re 16"-20"
Yep, am definitely calling “hokum” on the article, though not on trout being relatively more delicate than panfish.
As a former Trout in the Classroom liaison for my local chapter, 55 gallons (208 liters) is the minimum that’s recommended. In a 55 gallon tank, you raise a maximum of 100 eggs to fry stage in about 4.5 months. The difference between those projects and the hatcheries and what is being discussed here, is that both TiC and hatcheries artificially cool and oxygenate the water. This enables the trout to have “similar” conditions to the wild.
I’m not understanding your point at all, unfortunately. Could you restate?
Feisty…hahahahaa.
Calling everything false can only work if you are a President.
I doubt people are writing these articles to generate debate. I suspect there is a lot of truth in the guidance. You could always prove them wrong.
For kicks I found another article… smaller recommendation 200 gallon minimum but the same notes.
http://www.allabout-aquariumfish.com/2011/10/guide-on-keeping-trout-as-pets.html
Peder was noting the classroom stuff and the size of the trout being raised. Smaller tanks…much much smaller fish…as inf fry and fingerling, yet still need a bit of care and climate control that may be beyond what it would be to keep a warm water critter happy.
A buddy of mine had a 7 inch largemouth in a 20 gallon tank for years. Minimal care. I doubt one could do the same with a trout of the same size.
regarding hatcheries…far more complex than it looks…fast forward to 1:04 if you are impatient, there is a good illustration on how much is behind those pools. Pretty insane engineering.
I only noted this stuff as these trout we pursue are pretty picky about the water they inhabit. In my area, a lot of the stocked fish die off as the water temps just get to high. Not enough oxygen…but what is there in their place taking my flies are the bluegill and the juvenile bass.
There are notes to fighting trout in warm water. Some folk dont even target them in the summer as any fight can exhaust them past their ability to recover.
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I wish I could like a post twice.
Ok, Got you re: Peder. But thoughtful care is somewhat implied though, even with warmwater species, is it not? One can’t keep fish that need 80F/30C temps in the typical home that’s only heated to 68F/25F and less at night in the winter, right? Thus to me the need for a chiller vs heater is a wash. Even more thoughtful care would be needed for marine invertebrates.
FWIW, as someone that has lost an entire beautiful tank full of SE Asian fish due to a heater failure over a weekend (the home was left unheated while we were away, so down to 40F at night) I’d recommend two chillers to keep trout. Much as I now use two heaters, both with the capacity to maintain the required temps.
I’ll have to take a look at the other article/video. There was just so much that’s wrong in the first one that it put me off. Tank size, pond depth, A picture of what I think might be a mountain whitefish instead of a trout, the fact that the average rainbow grows to 27 pounds in a lake but browns get MUCH larger, etc, etc…
Ok, looks like the second trout in aquaria article is a condensation of the first - again 200-1000 gallon tank, live food… Unfortunately, neither article talks about objective measurements on harmful substances in the water (nitrogen), nor hardness, pH.
The video from the Ontario fish hatchery already shows one major difference from the fish hatcheries I’m familiar with here (Nimbus/Feather River) in that in Ontario, they’re using well water and running it through aeration towers. The hatcheries here just divert water from the main flow, and run it through their “ponds”. The same water is diverted to a fish ladder so that Salmon and Steelhead can enter and be captured for egg/milt extraction.
I am also of the opinion that there are a lot of places with water that is certainly pure enough for trout, but for various reasons there just is not a lot of trout food. Siltation not only makes it difficult for trout to live in, but also cuts down on BMI habitat as well. Here in the Sierras, there are numbers of “sterile” mountain lakes with plenty of pure snow-melt water, and yet no trout, because no bugs.
And now to perhaps the crux of the matter. It looks like the literature is pointing to the fact that mortality is EXTREMELY dependent on water temperature. At least for artificial lures, bait is another issue. See this link for an overview of a number of articles: https://henrysfork.org/files/Rob%20Blog/C%26R%20mortality%20review.pdf
Perhaps the true takeaway is it doesn’t matter how carefully you handle the fish, if the water temp is over 20C, go fish for something besides trout.
Regards.
Scott
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Right on Scott. Its all relative. Any animal in captivity requires care. I guess I am the cause for this branch in the thread with my comparison of warm and cold water fish. My initial note here was to illustrate how much more consideration there is for trout handling. Whether it be habitat or how we catch and release them.
Thats pretty cool that you have aquariums. It would be cool to see your setup and the kinds of critters you keep. In general, that would be a fun thread and makes me wonder who else has aquariums. It must have been heart breaking to have that heater failure with the SE Asian fish tank. Its always a bummer to have a pet and in this case pets…die. So much effort and bond between them. Years ago a buddy of mine had a saltwater tank with a small moray eel and other fish. We came back to his apartment after a vacation and could not find the eel in the tank. “Where is my eel?” I look on the ground and there is a dried up S shaped form. The eel did a poorly thought out jail break. I picked up the rigid fish chip and he confirmed the deceased. My friend was devastated. He never replaced leonard.
I personally always wanted to have a nice tank, but realize I do not have the discipline or time to properly take care of them. Recently we got my daughter a tank, that we populated with guppies and mollys…which as you know are probably the easiest fish to take care of…hahahhaha…but we and the pet store clerk screwed up and mixed male and female. We ended up with a bunch of fry and my wife refused to snuff them out, so now we have 2 tanks of those critters. There may be no end to it…we may end up being a muppy farm. Need some muppies?